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Hello Folks,

I'm getting back into dirt bike riding after roughly a 30 year hiatus and I'd REALLY like to get into hard enduro, using Trials techniques. I bought my bike with the intention of forcing myself to learn these advanced techniques on the machine I'd be riding. I figured that while it may be a little harder to learn, I'd probably learn better technique using the heavier machine. That said, I'm beginning to wonder if I might be better off buying a Trials bike and learning those techniques on one of those bikes and then adapting them to a regular full sized bike??? I've been watching tons of videos and it seems that a lot of the better enduro riders have a Trials background and learned their advanced techniques on a Trials bike and then applied them to enduro riding.

I'm curious for ya'll's thoughts on whether or not it's worth investing in Trials bike, knowing that's not going to be your primary ride...just to learn better technique??? This 450 still has me on my toes and I can clearly see how I'd be more inclined to try certain things on a lighter/smaller bike than I would this thing, at this point...but IS IT REALLY NECESSARY? Or, should I just keep working on Trials techniques until I have them down on my 450...provided she doesn't kill me in the process?

At somewhere around a half century old, I don't want to waste any time I don't have too waste...but I DO want to get good at hard enduro for getting around these mountains in N. ID...and I'm pretty sure I'm wired for it. Thank you in advance for any feedback I might get on this!

I rode Trials back in the 70's , but it is completely different than the skillset needed for todays Trials , or hard enduro riding ,, about all you needed with the old stuff was balance and throttle and brake control , now you need to practice balance , timing , sizing up what you are trying to maneuver thru or over , , sizing up how much input is needed to clear said obstacle , and picking good lines on the fly in little to no head time ... what also is a plus that they don't mention much is height , 6 ft. is a huge advantage over someone who is 5'6" or like me 5'9" , I can barely touch 1 tip-toe on my 450R on level ground , should you need to dab , you need to be able to actually touch the ground or you are going to be on the ground in most extreme enduro situations , I watch them regularly , and I think I could do ok doing it , not pro level ok , but amature level no problem , if I could afford the trip I would love to try Erzberg

And I have done some Endurocross stuff on my 450X


If you are looking for a good "in-between" bike , a KTM Freeride is a good choice , it has the basics of a trials bike with larger tank capacity and a more regular bike feel , but also the lightness of a trials bike (though not as light , but lighter than a regular enduro bike)

The biggest thing with hard enduro is , you need to look ahead , and not hesitate on choosing a line , and the line you choose needs to be a smart line , that will not only get you thru that section , but set you up for the next one , and so on , its all about flowing and maintaining momentum ... it does not have to be fast momentum , just consistent maintaining of movement , the more you stop , the more you have a chance at falling over or not being able to make it thru a section or loosing balance

I am assuming you have some farms around you .... see if one of them will give you a pile of old tractor tires , various sizes (loader tires work great as shown in my picture , we stacked them straight up so you were forced to go over the tire , and the ones on the ground were filled with the bark I am riding over , we also incorporated a shipping container to go thru (doors open on both ends) , and you can fill the tires with dirt or bark to make them more manageable to go over , same goes for using the bark as a obstacle , soft bark is actually hard to go thru , especially when forced to go slow because you just went over a loader tire , lay the loader tires out about 3-4 ft. apart , so you have to either jump from tire to tire , or step down/up to each , a fallen tree makes a good jump log or series of them , even one to ride along the top of inline with the layout , you can either spike them in place so they don't roll or build up dirt/rocks to hold them in place .... set yourself up a small (depending on the area you have to work with) course , that you can circle around and take the obstacles from different directions so you have various options to choose from , when going thru them .....

You can see more of the course layout I did in this pic , basically the tires , container , bark pile , railroad ties and logs made for a challenging course , I added this section for some off road races we did at the track when my friend was running the place (the track I currently ride) as a challenge section ... , then it was fun just to ride it on its own as well for a little fun , it actually can go into a loop back over top of the container then back thru it , we also did mud drags (you can see the course in the background), and 4 Stroke National , and WORCS races there , along with MX


Hopefully that gave you some ideas and tips .... I don't know everything about it , and far from a pro at it , but I have done a bit of it ...

Yes, to answer part of your question. I am a trials rider. I have had three GasGas trials bikes.
To learn trials skills, you need a trials bike - period. Anyone else telling you something different is full of crap.
They are engineered for doing exactly that- Trials ride. You will learn all new skills that you never will get being just a dirt bike rider. Those new skills will greatly enhance your dirt bike riding to a new level also - that's the bonus. You will learn to do things you probably never thought you could do. These modern trials bikes are incredible machines. You will learn power control, clutch, and both brakes together skills. You will surprise yourself with how much can be done on one tire and any angle.
Get yourself a trials bike instead of trying to do it the other way around. Save yourself the grief and disappointment. It's the only way you will learn trials skills. You may find it to be even more enjoyable than regular dirt bikes. I know I have.

I appreciate the input gentlemen. Looks like it's time to start researching Trials bikes. Thanks again!

Gas Gas txt300 is a great one, so is the 250. Raga editions are the top deal for goodies on them.
The Sherco bikes are also really nice machines. If you want a 4 stroke there is the Montesa. I have not ridden one but one of our club members in the competitions does really well on his.
To be honest, I think all the trials bikes are top-notch, high-end machines. They are like using a razor-sharp filleting knife over a butter knife for fine trimming work. They are very highly engineered machines built for one thing.
Remember, trials riding is all about finesse over anything else. Learning to use power control, brakes, clutch all at the same time. Ballance comes, to a point as a natural human instinct. Granted it will get better as time goes on riding and doing the challenging moves but all the other items is what needs to be the primary focus.
If you join a club it will help as does a competition event.
When I lived in AZ it was boulders, rocks, and really loose slippery terrain. Here in SD, it is boulders, tree stumps, and creek beds. Completely different conditions. Still the same skills just how you attack sections is different.
Not sure any of this helps but there you have it.
You will find a trials bike will make you a better rider in all other applications. Trying to learn trials skills on any other type of bike is back to the - trying to do fine trimming with a butter knife.

Good luck, hope to hear back with what you decide to get. Showing my age - My first two trials bikes were back in the mid-70's with Honda TL 125 & 250's. Yamaha came out the 2 stroke TY bikes and changed everything. My friend still has his old TY250, two of them in fact. Boy, are they a trip back in the time machine to ride.

Sorry for the long-winded response.

Thanks for the additional info! I've got a good place to start, anyway! My first dirt bike was from back in the 70's too...a little YZ80...though I never got into real Trials riding.

Yeah, Jim, I have been thinking about talking to a few friends who own mining businesses about picking up their old tires to set up my own obstacle course. I hadn't even thought of farmers but I know a couple of them too.

I reckon I'll start looking for a club or some other Trials riders to hook up with. If it's going to help with all motorcycle riding, I'm all game!