[Honda17]

Hey guys. I have a question i was wondering if you could help me answer it.

Today i was riding and i hit a jump and when i landed my bike staled/died (I'm not sure which). then when i went to start it back up it was VERY VERY hard to kick. then i tried to use the hot start. this made it a little bit easier to kick and i finally got it running. however when it was running it would only keep running when i gave it gas it wouldn't idle (earlier that day it idled perfect)

Then i shut it off to check some things and now cant get it started and it is still REALLY hard to kick over

[turbo]

not sure why it is hard to kick over but normally when they are hard to start the valve gap has gone tight

[Honda17]

yeah i know about that... learned that last fall when i had to do the valves.... i don't think its that because i checked them like a month ago... i was planning on checking them tomorrow tho and ill let you know what i find out

[Honda17]

alright i just got done taking the head cover off and found out some BAD news!!!!

there are TONS of metal shavings all around the exhaust valve bases and inside the camshaft also there is tons under the auto decompression system? So basically they are all inside my head!!

what could be causing the metal shavings? what are some things i could check for? should i check the piston to make sure it is not damaged

ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED SO MUCH

[TDW]

ouch, tons of metal shavings probably means a costly repair. I would probably start by first checking the eng oil level and then draining it to see if it is full of metal as well, also use a magnet to see the shavings stick to it or not, may be aluminum or may be small metal particles. Was the coolant level full? Were there any unusual noises before you noticed an obvious problem? How bout any dis colored or burnt parts seen on top with the valve cover off? Oh, and do you like to work on motorcycles!!!

[Honda17]

the engine oil was fine... i check it every time before i go out..... i will drain it tomorrow and let you know if it consists of metal particals. the coolant was also full i check that too before i ride

no unsual noise and and no burnt parts

[fbr]

My first guess was that you dropped a valve. But then it shouldn't start at all. You say hard to "kick" as in too much compression. I had the counterweight break off of the auto decompression mechanism on an '05 CRF250R. (That part needs to be replaced periodically.) How about the cam chain, did it slip a tooth? Has it been replaced? That might make it hard to kick but doesn't really explain metal shavings in the head. Look closely at the decompressor system (weight, spring, bolt, stopper plate, etc). Are you sure it is all there? I'm betting the weight broke off making it hard to kick over and then it was ground to bits before the remnants dropped down the cam chain shaft into the flywheel side of the engine. Look in there for larger pieces and verify timing chain is still on the correct teeth.

[Honda17]

ok thanks for the info i will check that and let you know what i find.

but first how can u tell if the timing chain is on the correct teeth.

[fbr]

Remove the valve cover and spark plug. Remove the crankshaft hole cap. Set the engine to TDC on the compression stroke. Check that the punch mark on the crankshaft aligns with the index mark and the two index lines on the cam sprocket are aligned with and parallel to the cylinder head/valve cover mating surface. If these all line up then the cam chain is installed correctly. It is possible for the chain to jump a tooth and also possible to install it off by one tooth.

[the hawk]

the same thing happened to my brother who has the 250 he never changed his oil and wondered why it was hard to start he pulled to head and same as you had tons of metal shavings then he drained the oil and what do you know there were even more

Damn hondas

[fbr]

Some of these symptoms are ambiguous, like the engine stalling after landing a jump and hard to kick over. However, the one symptom is unambiguous and serious and that is metal shavings in the head. You need to start searching for the source of these shavings. Start with a magnet. Are they iron or a non-iron alloy like aluminum? If there is nothing obvious on top of the head than it is time to pull the cylinder and inspect the piston. When you do this it would be nice to protect the crankcase from these shavings.

[Honda17]

ok i drained the oil and checked the oil filter to see if there were any metal shavings> the oild filter is COMPLETELY COVERED in metal shavings. The shaving are gold/bronze

does this help narrow down the problem?

[124]

Main crank-rod bearing is wasted. Need help?

[TDW]

It sounds like the bottom end is in need of a rebuild, with the metal contamination probably have top end issues also. $$ I would call around for estimates. May be others on this site who have had to get this much work done and could offer advice on where to get it fixed or what parts to use etc. Gonna have to get the inside of your engine cleaned out really good.