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b-town
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 2
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 Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:50 am Post subject: 2010 Honda CRF450 Motocross bike - ECU interface |
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Hi All,
Does anyone here know, or know how to find out the communications protocol used by the 2010 ECU interface? I need to read throttle position, RPM etc. from the ECU using some custom electronics (I know the Honda FI tool can do this, I need to know how!). Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance for any input  |
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paul turner
Joined: 22 Sep 2005
Posts: 8530
Location: '08er
2005 Honda CRF450X
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| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 6:38 am Post subject: |
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Prolly simple ascii. Just a hunch.
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b-town
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| I really need to know the interface details including the phy level used. Anyone else have any clue or know anyone who does?? |
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AgentSmith
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 16195
Location: In the Matrix...Waiting for an Exit.
2006 Honda CRF450X
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| b-town wrote: |
| I really need to know the interface details including the phy level used. Anyone else have any clue or know anyone who does?? |
I'm sure the engineers at Honda aren't sharing. They don't want aftermarket companies knocking off their PGM-FI tool.
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"Make a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day.
Light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
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mikey526
Joined: 01 Apr 2007
Posts: 1105
Location: Wisconsin
2007 Honda CRF150R
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| AgentSmith wrote: |
| b-town wrote: |
| I really need to know the interface details including the phy level used. Anyone else have any clue or know anyone who does?? |
I'm sure the engineers at Honda aren't sharing. They don't want aftermarket companies knocking off their PGM-FI tool. |
What about Yoshimura and the few others that must have figured something out? I guess Yosh has close ties with Honda racing but what about the other companies?
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AgentSmith
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 16195
Location: In the Matrix...Waiting for an Exit.
2006 Honda CRF450X
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| mikey526 wrote: |
| AgentSmith wrote: |
| b-town wrote: |
| I really need to know the interface details including the phy level used. Anyone else have any clue or know anyone who does?? |
I'm sure the engineers at Honda aren't sharing. They don't want aftermarket companies knocking off their PGM-FI tool. |
What about Yoshimura and the few others that must have figured something out? I guess Yosh has close ties with Honda racing but what about the other companies? |
They haven't cracked the Honda OEM unit, they replace it with their own ECM and harness. Their unit plugs into the throttle body, the crank position sensor, the TPS, etc.
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"Make a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day.
Light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
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mikey526
Joined: 01 Apr 2007
Posts: 1105
Location: Wisconsin
2007 Honda CRF150R
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 5:20 am Post subject: |
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| AgentSmith wrote: |
| mikey526 wrote: |
| AgentSmith wrote: |
| b-town wrote: |
| I really need to know the interface details including the phy level used. Anyone else have any clue or know anyone who does?? |
I'm sure the engineers at Honda aren't sharing. They don't want aftermarket companies knocking off their PGM-FI tool. |
What about Yoshimura and the few others that must have figured something out? I guess Yosh has close ties with Honda racing but what about the other companies? |
They haven't cracked the Honda OEM unit, they replace it with their own ECM and harness. Their unit plugs into the throttle body, the crank position sensor, the TPS, etc. |
Oooooooh that makes sense. I didn't know that.
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124
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 3701
Location: SE Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:38 am Post subject: |
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Multiple issues here:
1) The CAN/LAN analyzer equipment & software license needed to communicate on the bus is expensive.
2) You would need to know the serial commands to change anything. Even if you get the protocol identified, you wouldn't know how to communicate on it. Normally, CAN/LAN protocol comes with a hefty user manual. This is all proprietary to the OE.
Last LAN based protocol I needed to be familiar with came with a 1,100 pg manual and a $20k piece of equipment to test on it. Probably an extreme case given what Honda needs to do on a motorcycle, but you get the idea...
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70' Honda CT70 (Trail 70; Gold)
05' Honda CRF450R
06' Honda CRF50
00' Honda XR80R |
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DezertTim
Joined: 30 Oct 2008
Posts: 83
Location: costa mesa
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:52 am Post subject: |
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but are they even using anything close to a CAN system when your only running an engine and its only a few parts at that? the way i see it, its using a giant relay to switch an injector and a spark plug....but then again i do work on over complicated german cars everyday.
I have worked with guys that have done the reverse engineering on the bosch and simos control units used by bmw/audi/vw/porsche and so on. its a long proscess.
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2007 crf 250x
2002 cr250r
2003 chevy silverado/ camburg long travel
2004 audi s4 |
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124
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 3701
Location: SE Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:09 am Post subject: |
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| DezertTim wrote: |
| I have worked with guys that have done the reverse engineering on the bosch and simos control units used by bmw/audi/vw/porsche and so on. its a long proscess. |
The ECU on the CRF's must have some sort of CAN, even if it's simple. Otherwise, the $300 tool is no more than an expensive PWM module. Which is possible...  , but I doubt it.
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70' Honda CT70 (Trail 70; Gold)
05' Honda CRF450R
06' Honda CRF50
00' Honda XR80R |
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